Dutch Boyd - Interview With a Champion

By Justin West

Television doesn't do it justice - it really doesn't. If you've watched The World Series of Poker on ESPN, you might catch a small glimpse of the elation, the surge of emotion that washes over a player as they play that final winning hand. You might even feel a bit of that excitement as they become all grins, hold those giant wads of cash over their head, but I have to tell you - it's nothing compared to seeing it in person.

I met Dutch Boyd for the first time about a week before he made his appearance at the final table of the $2,500 buy-in short-handed event of the 2006 World Series of Poker.

Dutch seemed incredibly confident to me, and I remember thinking that he was a lot more humble than I'd have guessed. On television he's always portrayed as arrogant, self-absorbed, and perhaps more than a little headstrong. While he does, certainly, exude a few of these qualities to some degree, by and large he's a very personable individual, very eager to talk with his fans and even more eager to lend a helping hand. I was honestly surprised by how easy he was to approach, even more surprised to find that he was a real person, not just some myth created by the ESPN crews.

Dutch wasn't the only person I knew in that event, however. David Solomon, who went out first to little fanfare at the final table, is a local Austin player that I've been playing against for years. Incidentally, I took about $500 off of him the day before this event started at the $2-5 no-limit table. I think with a cash worth more than $15k in this event, he more than one-upped me.

One by one the final table players made their exits, and Dutch was left heads-up with the 2005 WSOP main event winner, Mr. Joe Hachem. I remember feeling a little guilty, poised in anticipation behind a throng of Dutch's supporters, since as a journalist I'm supposed to be impartial. But having gotten to know Dutch, I really wanted him to win.

As fate would have it, Dutch took the bracelet down. The crowd behind him erupted into applause, and Dutch was visibly elated. He pumped his fists in triumph, embraced his supporters, and displayed the biggest smile I've seen in a long time. The energy in the room was unmistakable.

I snapped a photo as he grabbed his girlfriend, Ali's, hand, and bolted from the room. The two of them darted from the tournament area, out into the corridor, and made their way to the Ultimate Bet lounge. Champagne was opened, shared by all, and I looked on with glee as Dutch hugged his mother with a tear in his eye.

Words simply cannot express how happy he was, and how happy everyone was for him. Here was a man who had finally proved himself, had finally achieved one of his life-long dreams. Good stuff.

I made it known to Dutch that I wanted an interview, and in the wake of his success he was more than happy to grant it. He caught up with me one night as I smoked a cigarette.

"Want to go ahead and get the interview out of the way?" he asked.

Of course!

"So, you were inspired by the film, Rounders, to start playing, as I think a lot of players were," I began, cracking the beer Dutch had bought me as we took our seat in the Milwaukee's Best garage behind the tournament area. "What was it about the movie that struck you the most?"

"Well," said Dutch. "I really identified with Matt Damon's character. I was in law school at the time, as was Mike, Matt's character. This was the first time I saw that people were making a living playing poker, and how serious people were taking it. I really wanted to be like Mike."

"So did you win right from the start?"

"Yes. I first started playing at an online site called 2 A.M. It was a dealer's choice game, and it was free. If you could rack up a million in play chips they'd send you $100. Me and a few other guys did that and made a lot of cash that way, and eventually the site ended up changing their policy."

Hmph. I've heard the stories about Phil Hellmuth making over $20,000 his first year, and I never had that kind of success, myself. I supposed part of me had hoped he'd say "No! I had to learn!"

"So you graduated law school at what age?"

"18."

"Did you really want to be a lawyer?"

Dutch had to think about this one for a second.

"When I started, yes. But as I got further and further into my education I began to realize that I didn't know too many happy lawyers."

"Would you have been a criminal lawyer?"

"Yes, definitely. Truth be told I'm still thinking of taking the bar later this year and doing something with it."

As far as I know, Dutch has yet to take the bar. God help us if he becomes a lawyer, though. I think he'd be the first trial lawyer in history to defend his client in cut-offs, flip flops, a bandanna and sunglasses.

"Did what you learned in law school help you as a poker player?" I asked.

Dutch's response was immediate. "Oh, definitely. There are a lot of things lawyers do that are incredibly helpful to a poker player. You learn how to analyze, how to draw conclusions. It's why a lot of players you see in this room right now actually went to law school. Trials are a lot like a poker game."

"Since you made the move into professional poker," I began. "Has there ever been a moment where you've doubted your choice, thought maybe it wasn't for you?"

This question was inspired by my own lack of any real success when I went semi-pro on the Austin underground circuit a few years back. In retrospect, I think the question was dumb, as why would anyone who just won a bracelet question their decision? Dutch's answer confirmed this.

"Absolutely not. I've never doubted it. I think that any player sitting down at a table, any good player, knows they're good. You just know it. There's any number of things that are necessary for a poker player to possess. Card sense, instincts... I think you're born with these things and you can't learn them from a book."

"So you'd equate it to chess masters being born with this incredible gift and not having to even try to learn it."

"Absolutely. I think that's a great way to put it."

I suppose he's right - that's a good way to put it, but again it confirms how much of a loser I am. Anyway, onto the meat of the interview.

"So now you've won your first bracelet - describe for me the feeling you had when your realized you'd done it, that you'd actually won your first bracelet."

"Shock. Complete and total shock. It was a miracle, the best feeling I've ever had. This put me in a club, you know?" Dutch said, pointing down at the bracelet he proudly wears on his wrist. "No matter what happens, even if I go broke and lose every dime that I won in that tournament, no one can take this away from me.

"I remember when I was about 15 or 16 I made a list of about 100 things I wanted to accomplish in life. This bracelet was the one thing I wondered if I'd ever be able to check off. "

"So what is it about the bracelet that makes it so coveted?"

"Well," Dutch said, again eying his bracelet, clearly and deservedly proud. "It's the Super Bowl ring of poker. Not only is it validation of a poker player's ability, it's proof. You tell people you're a professional poker player and they tend to doubt you, but this is a way to prove it to them."

With a bit of the chit-chat questions out of the way, I felt it was safe to move into more uncharted territory. I recalled something Dutch had said to me a few days before...

"I remember you talking a few days ago about this, and I wanted your permission to print it - is it true you were backed in the tournament?"

"Yes. It is," Dutch said, quite pointedly.

"So it's true, then, that $340,000 of your winnings from that event went to your backers?"

Dutch wasted no time with his answer.

"Absolutely. And of course I want you to print that! It's the truth."

"How did it feel to give away $340,000 of your winnings to your backers?"

"Honestly? It sucks! But like I said," he points to the bracelet again, light glinting off of the diamonds on its face. "They can never take this away from me."

My mind wandered back to the biography on him that I'd read after becoming acquainted.

"You've been diagnosed as bi-polar. Has that hurt your play at all?"

"In the past it has, sure. But there have been times where I'm in a hyper-manic, or an all-out manic state, and I've had a moment of clarity, so to speak... reached some breakthrough that has helped my game immensely."

"So you're saying that the bi-polar disease may actually have helped your poker play?" I asked, more than a little surprised at his answer.

"Absolutely! It's been a tremendous advantage. Some of the best ideas I've had in regards to my play have come in a manic state.

"For instance, last year when I took second place to T.J. Cloutier in that WSOP event, just three weeks prior I was in a concrete cell in Antigua, out of my mind. All I could think about for three weeks was how I was going to win that bracelet. I have no doubt that if it would have been a 'donkey' I was playing heads up instead of T.J., I would have taken that bracelet.

"I've also had ideas just in the past week or so on how to apply game theory to poker, and look at what happened - I got my bracelet."

Of course, no article on Dutch would be complete unless you bring up the obvious...

"Okay, this is the elephant in the room. I hate to ask you about it, but I'm honestly curious. I won't ask you about what happened with PokerSpot, but after you won this event was there any part of you that was worried about people approaching you for money after your victory?

"Ah," he said, chuckling. "Why ya gotta bring up old shit?"

"Hey!" I said in my defense. "I'm just asking. Are you worried people are going to ask for your cash?"

"Well they do, all the time," said Dutch, his gaze aimed somewhere in the distance. I could tell he didn't like talking about this. "I've had like $40,000 cashes here and there, and people always ask. But in the end, like I said earlier, I didn't even keep all that cash. $340,000 went straight to my backers. I'm more interested in moving forward and trying to get RakeFree off of the ground."

For those not in the know, Dutch has been trying to get a rake-free poker site off of the ground but it has yet to happen.

"So tell me about RakeFree.com? How can one make money on a rake-free poker game?"

"Well," he began. "If you take a look around the web, it's not difficult. Two-Plus-Two makes tons of money off of book sales, other sites make money on advertising. The main costs in operating an online site these days are in marketing, not on the operational side of things. It costs very little to actually operate the game itself once you have everything in place."

"Well, as I understand it, poker had until recently been considered a loss leader by casinos, and the rake was to compensate for that so the house could earn money. Would you agree with that?"

Dutch shook his head. "I remember I used to play in San Jose and there were about four tables, only two of them were full at any time. They had a promotion going wherein the first six players that showed up for a game that bought in for $60 would get $100 total. So I did that for a while, and would consistently win.

"The gaming laws in that area forced this game to close at midnight, and I remember they used to pull out the drop for the rake and count all the money right there on the table in front of us. It usually amounted to about $2000 a day, and that's just with a field of about 20 people.

"I'm sitting there, big winner with $200 over my buy-in, and I realized then that poker is NOT a loss leader. It's a common saying, but it isn't true. They say it's a loss leader compared to craps, but the truth is that the casinos make just as much money off of poker as they do with craps, it just takes longer. A player can step up to a craps table and lose a thousand dollars in no time, whereas it might take them three months to make that off of a single poker player.

"So, no, poker is not a loss leader now, and it never was."

Fair enough.

"So now that you've got your bracelet - do you feel like you can relax?

"Yes, most definitely," he said, that grin coming back. I got a chill for a second as I remembered his moment of victory. "I feel like I don't have anything to prove anymore - I've already done it."

"What about the main event?"

"Ah, see, that's different. Only a handful of people - what, thirty? - have won that one. It's an entirely different animal."

I ask the following question of everyone, but I think I'm going to stop. I keep getting the same answer!

"Do you think that skill has taken a back seat to luck these days?"

"Absolutely not, and I think that's apparent just by looking at who's coming out on top in the events that are going on now. Sammy Farha, Phil Ivey, Daniel Negreanu, Carlos Mortensen - there are big players near the top of every event. People may say that it's luck, because you can get lucky in poker, but in the end skill is the biggest factor. The cream rises to the top."

If I hear "the cream rises to the top" one more time I'm going to scream, I think. Don't expect me to ask anyone else that question, ever again. Time for the final question...

"Do you think the nature of becoming a professional poker player has changed?" I asked. "Previously, one had to work their way up the ranks, now an online qualifier can turn you into a millionaire over night..."

"Certainly. Poker has changed," said Dutch. "Like you said, you used to have to build your bankroll up slowly, work your way to the top, but now getting that bankroll might be easier. You still have to be a great player and continue to win to be recognized, though. That's key."

More Interviews

Justin West played poker since the age of 17, he spent more than a year earning a living on the green felt; a modest living, to be sure, but a living nonetheless. His aim was at one point to win the WSOP main event, thus causing Hell to freeze over. However, given his penchant for sin and his extreme dislike of cold weather, Justin has put that dream to rest.